Path: spln!rex!extra.newsguy.com!lotsanews.com!feeder.qis.net!priapus.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!hermes.visi.com!gemini.tycho.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Approved: sci-military-moderated@retro.com Return-Path: news@google.com Delivery-Date: Sat Feb 23 22:36:05 2002 Delivery-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 22:36:05 -0800 for <sci-military-moderated@retro.com>; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 22:36:03 -0800 (PST) id 16erz7-0007Lm-00 for sci-military-moderated@moderators.isc.org; Sun, 24 Feb 2002 07:18:09 +0100 for <sci-military-moderated@moderators.isc.org>; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 22:18:08 -0800 for <sci-military-moderated@moderators.isc.org>; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 22:18:08 -0800 for sci-military-moderated@moderators.isc.org; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 22:18:07 -0800 To: sci-military-moderated@moderators.isc.org From: psl@interchange.ubc.ca (Paul Lakowski) Newsgroups: sci.military.moderated Subject: Re: Effectiveness of HESH against modern armor Date: 23 Feb 2002 22:18:06 -0800 Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Message-ID: <de5bf54f.0202232218.7b3c57ab@posting.google.com> References: <3c672d5.0202201603.64165060@posting.google.com> <da4a16f.0202220937.768221f1@posting.google.com> <t7ad7uo8q0i30bg785n1itb3ln6gsrue7e@4ax.com> <de5bf54f.0202222130.50cc4d86@posting.google.com> <a57g73$s5u$1@gw.retro.com> <adqf7ugvr8gjr8dbr95ni1gubl3kg05kl9@4ax.com> <a58vuc013ho@enews1.newsguy.com> X-NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.23.94.4 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com X-NNTP-Posting-Date: 24 Feb 2002 06:18:07 GMT Content-Length: 1579 Lines: 30 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2dcc343f.newsreader.tycho.net X-Trace: 1014600244 gemini.tycho.net 79557 205.179.181.194 X-Complaints-To: abuse@tycho.net Xref: spln sci.military.moderated:43068 TTK Ciar <ttk@NOSPAM_delete_all_after_org.ciar.org.amazon.com> wrote in message news:<a58vuc013ho@enews1.newsguy.com>... > Once upon a time, Robb McLeod <rmcleod@islandnet.com> said: > > Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 11:26:33 -0800 > [..snip..] > >Most modern MBTs aren't going to suffer first-round penetrator by > >similarly advanced long rod penetrators so the shear damage that HESH > >can inflict on the structure is fairly attractive. > > Would it be at all practical to construct a hybrid HESH/KE munition, > in which the HESH warhead preceeded the KE penetrator by a few feet, > to "soften" the target's armor (wiping ERA and pulverizing ceramics), > and increase the penetrator rod's chances of making a kill? > > It seems to me that since the HESH and the KE rod would be in line, > the HESH warhead could be quite small, because it would only need to > "soften" the armor in the exact location of the KE rod's impact. > > -- TTK I don't think you have to go that far actually. Since from what Ive seen in research papers shock damage to ceramic steel sandwich shows the damage/delamination/ceramic shatter area is > twice the projectile diameter and HESH seems to deform to ~ twice its diameter before detonation. Then the possible damage area is > 4 times this diameter. So if we think of 120mm HESH, then thats a radius of > 25cm or an area of ~1800cm^3. Put another way modern APFSDS mil accuracy is often 33cm @ 3km so if you keep the cross hairs on the target and fire a APFSDS after a HESH . You do have a good chance of hitting this shattered area.